tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post7729027571625288024..comments2024-03-28T05:22:10.255-07:00Comments on Broadsword by Ajai Shukla - Strategy. Economics. Defence.: First Akash missile system to fill gap in air defenceBroadswordhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13076780076240598482noreply@blogger.comBlogger27125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-38021392774173842622010-11-25T17:33:42.434-08:002010-11-25T17:33:42.434-08:00To Anon@10.32: I guess from an aesthetic standpoin...To Anon@10.32: I guess from an aesthetic standpoint, other TATA-made high-mobility vehicles would have been the preferred solution, but in the case of the IAF's Akash, there's simply no operational need for a high-mobility vehicle since the Akash will not be deployed as far away as even 30km away from the static VA/VP it is supposed to defend. <br /><br />To Anon@11.48: That's right. The IAF's Akash versions will NEVER be cross-deployed with any other end-user. That is precisely why the Army's Akash variant uses the T-72M as the missile launch vehicle and carrier of the Rajendra BLR, while almost all motorised support vehicles are of the BEML/Tatra 8 x 8 type. The question you need to ask is: is the IAF's Akash/Rohini 3-D CAR variant air-transportable?Prasun K. Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17625525921341864605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-12004485904063203772010-11-25T08:36:17.085-08:002010-11-25T08:36:17.085-08:00hmmmmm..... just read somewhere that india was sec...hmmmmm..... just read somewhere that india was secretly sold s-300 systems a long time back.... even the wiki page mentions india could have s-300 or older systems... don think only sa-6 wud be trusted for so long..satyamnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-33008582203575458302010-11-24T09:40:59.924-08:002010-11-24T09:40:59.924-08:00To Broadsword:
Pls disregard my last post because...To Broadsword:<br /><br />Pls disregard my last post because I found out that my son has messed it up (even with Live Fist too)<br /><br />Sorry for that...Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10329289815554890039noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-89527941040745709732010-11-24T09:32:08.785-08:002010-11-24T09:32:08.785-08:00Business Standard = BS = Bullshit!
See for yourse...Business Standard = BS = Bullshit!<br /><br />See for yourself:<br /><br /><b>India to buil<i>t</i> two test ranges of electronic warfare systems</b><br /><br /><br /><a href="http://bharat-rakshak.com/NEWS/newsrf.php?newsid=13831" rel="nofollow">Lol</a>Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10329289815554890039noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-40349710429780089082010-11-23T22:18:32.689-08:002010-11-23T22:18:32.689-08:00Will Akash will only protect static locations and ...Will Akash will only protect static locations and never be cross-deployed?<br />A military asset(and a very expensive one) needs to be versatile and mobile.IN any all out war Pakistan (and China?)will be attacking us constantly.How can we assume that these assets are just going to be static at one place.May they not be needed in other areas as the situation may evolve. Will they always get smooth roads and crater free locations,will they not face slush,mud within a large base itself.I will submit that any military asset has to fully capable to be deployed to meet any unpredictable scenario as far as possible.The is COTS at its cheapest.Such a system deserves far better.Its always better to have the capability and not need it rather than the other way around.And frank decent mobility and ruggedness is a sin-qua-non for any military vehicle.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-13904172468351692162010-11-23T21:36:14.899-08:002010-11-23T21:36:14.899-08:00Why could it not be mounted on truck such as this?...Why could it not be mounted on truck such as this?<br />http://www.defencesolutions-tatamotors.com/pdf/tata-8x8.pdf<br /><br />This is the MIM-104 Patriot.<br /><br />http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/eb/Patriot_System_2.jpg<br />Military Grade Tractor unit:<br />http://www.nato.int/pictures/2003/030310/b030310n.jpgAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-62687200841950889202010-11-23T21:02:27.975-08:002010-11-23T21:02:27.975-08:00Prasun@20:45
I am not having a problem on the IAF ...Prasun@20:45<br />I am not having a problem on the IAF SAM being a wheeled and not a tracked unit.The point that I am trying to make is that the Akash is towed by a civilian tractor.It does not appear to be even all-wheel drive ,what to talk about rugged suspension,high ground clearance.The SAM units you were referring to as 'motorized' were all rugged vehicles and high clearance vehicles. The OSA- AK with 6x6 drive was amphibious and air-transportable.The Ural vehicles on the Pechoras are also 6X6 units with excellent cross-country mobility.Same is the case of the towing tractor of the Dvina.The thing,i venture to repeat is,how can a missile unit,which is to be deployed as per any contingencies,have such a basic tractor attached to it.I would also submit that being 'left hand drive' should have no effect on the TATRA's or any other vehicle's cross-country mobility.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-21077831708097664662010-11-23T18:18:56.775-08:002010-11-23T18:18:56.775-08:00To Broadsword: It does clear up matters immensely ...To Broadsword: It does clear up matters immensely now, many thanks.Prasun K. Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17625525921341864605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-68993831268352495972010-11-23T18:10:36.155-08:002010-11-23T18:10:36.155-08:00Prasun:
Let me simplify things for you about the ...Prasun:<br /><br />Let me simplify things for you about the assembly lines.<br /><br />There will be two parallel assembly lines for the Akash: one at BDL and one at BEL. The reason for two parallel lines, is (a) firstly, a single line cannot produce the Akash as quickly as two lines; and (b) there is a strategic rationale for having a second line as a backup to the first.<br /><br />As you well know, sometimes it is not about economics.<br /><br />As far as the individual pieces of equipment go, they will be produced for both lines by whoever is doing it. For example, BEL Ghaziabad will produce the Rohini radar for both lines. BEL Bangalore will produce the 3D phased radar for both lines. BDL will produce the missiles for both lines. Etc, etc, etc.<br /><br />The NDTV report on VAs/VPs that you cite was done by me. It did not contain many of the details that I am now releasing.<br /><br />CLAWS and CAPS have not, to the best of my knowledge, released the exact figures of VAs/VPs. Do post a link if they have.<br /><br />Your figure of 300 VAs/VPs is irrelevant to any discussion of the Akash. It is important not to drag in tactical ground targets, like army corps and div HQs and artillery gun positions --- which are protected by tactical air defence weapons which are on the orbat of army formations --- with strategic and operational targets like, say BARC, or Bhakra Dam, which need to be catered to from a separate pool of resources.<br /><br />The latter is where the figure of 150 comes from.<br /><br />Trust that clears up matters?<br /><br />When you cite a figure of 300Broadswordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13076780076240598482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-87555245045796974312010-11-23T12:56:44.159-08:002010-11-23T12:56:44.159-08:00"The dangerous shortage of India’s air defenc..."The dangerous shortage of India’s air defence resources has been known to Business Standard for some time, but can only now be publicly revealed"<br /><br />Was it a CIA type classified secret, that U were privy to?<br /><br />Quote from BR:<br /><br />[Yep! Business Std.'s "sniffer doggies" found out what the whole world has known for a decade+! Neverthless,a good piece]<br /><br />Laughing out loud....Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-49014796931094246632010-11-23T10:55:27.318-08:002010-11-23T10:55:27.318-08:00Akash is coming just in the nick of time. Congrat...Akash is coming just in the nick of time. Congrats to the DRDO for developing it. Congrats to the IAF and the IA for having the sense to order it.<br /><br />I've heard that it's a world-class missile system (ECCM, etc.). The fact that it's inexpensive is very important because India has to counter the threat from large numbers of inexpensive Chinese cruise missiles.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-91678359365198139652010-11-23T09:46:20.685-08:002010-11-23T09:46:20.685-08:00Seems MOD's calculated risk taking is for a re...Seems MOD's calculated risk taking is for a reason.... like what is the garantee we import patriot3,5../iron dome/david's sling/barak-8,2/spyder... and as if all has a master key (and if it exists), it won't be turned off at a crucial moment of our country... nullifying all the posturing in one go??? ... (since Govt took such a huge gamble at very crucial phase of our economic transition...)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-12009726949625234792010-11-23T08:26:51.218-08:002010-11-23T08:26:51.218-08:00Dear Mr. Shukla,
Thanks for the wonderful
articl...Dear Mr. Shukla,<br /><br />Thanks for the wonderful <br />article.<br /><br />The only thing lacking in the article was comparison of Akash to other SAMs around the world and how Akash would match-up with them.<br /><br />Please do let us know about the details of Akash as well.<br /><br />Thanks<br /><br />Kunal<br /><br />PS:If there is any grammatical mistake in my post let me know.( Ha Ha..)Kunalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-38100542135966398292010-11-23T07:47:38.120-08:002010-11-23T07:47:38.120-08:00Mr.Ajai ,
Does india has idea to go for S-400 SAM...Mr.Ajai , <br />Does india has idea to go for S-400 SAM for longer range protection .Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-81535195612375762152010-11-23T07:15:30.618-08:002010-11-23T07:15:30.618-08:00To Anon@10.51 & ArjunTankFan: The Dvina V750VK...To Anon@10.51 & ArjunTankFan: The Dvina V750VK, S-125 Pechora and OSA-AK were and are all riding on motorised, not tracked, vehicles. One cannot therefore insist on the Akash (IAF variant) being mounted on rugged all-terrain vehicles or even tracked vehicles, which are more suited for cross-country travel--something the IAF's Akash-equipped squadrons will never engage in. The BEML-TATRA trucks are far worse off than the TATA-made trucks, since the so-called indigenised models rolling out from BEML are, till this day, all left-hand drives! Try asking BEML how exactly does it define indigenisation and ToT!<br /><br />To Broadsword: I'm afraid your explanation about "two parallel lines" still doesn't clear the confusion. Are you saying that BEL will build and assemble the Akash missiles for the first two squadrons, while BDL will build and assemble the Rohini 3-D CAR and Rajendra BLR radars for the six follow-on squadrons? Or will BEL, as prime contractor, procure the missile rounds from BDL and then handle final assembly and systems integration, while BDL (for the six follow-on squadrons) will in turn procure fully-assembled radars and command-and-control/comms systems from BEL and become prime contractor/systems integrator for this follow-on batch? I'm asking this because it makes no financial sense for two independent prime contractors to be created (with parallel assembly lines for the same product) for a single system which is being ordered in such limited quantity. <br />The specifics on the dangerous shortage of India’s air defence resources were publicly highlighted and detailed in a special report aired by NDTV in the first week of October 2006, and it also identified the vulnerable Strike Corps as being the XX1 Corps. In fact, the number of VAs and VPs is closer to the 300 mark when one includes the land-based installations of the Army and Navy, and of course now the SFC. The exact figures have been available with CAPS and CLAWS as open-source materials for more than five years.Prasun K. Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17625525921341864605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-9428105035553054282010-11-23T05:42:09.247-08:002010-11-23T05:42:09.247-08:00what? thought we have more than 150 vulnerable are...what? thought we have more than 150 vulnerable areas/points, akash systems are being produced at the rate of 1 every 9 months by bel?all i can say is wow!keep it up fellas.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-62409946260806467792010-11-23T05:41:57.426-08:002010-11-23T05:41:57.426-08:00I wonder why everyone seems to want to protect sta...I wonder why everyone seems to want to protect static air bases with an AD system mounted on high-mobility vehicles! Are the Gwalior and Pune air bases about to suddenly up and move?<br /><br />Cane-an: <br /><br />If 1200 Cr + 200 Cr is the cost of two systems, my math tells me that 700 Cr is the cost of each.<br /><br />Prasun: <br /><br />Two parallel Akash lines, one in BEL, the other in BDL.<br /><br />You write: "And what's with the facination with NATO designations of weapons of Soviet origin? Can't the SA-6 be referred to as KUB or Kvadrat"<br /><br />You're right, it could. And then someone could write, "what's the fascination with Soviet designations? Don't you know the Soviet Union is history...?"<br /><br />Besides, Kvadrat is also the designation of the T-72M1 land navigation system. Could get confusing...<br /><br />You write: "The dangerous shortage of India’s air defence resources has been public knowledge since early 2002 when OP Parakram was underway."<br /><br />I'm sure everyone had a general idea. But I don't recall reading in the public domain the kind of specifics that this article lays out.<br /><br />Shyam:<br /><br />All 150 VAs/VPs are not going to be defended by the Akash. You might recall, there are other anti-air missiles under development too. E.g. MR-SAM... SR-SAM... etc.<br /><br />Ravi:<br /><br />Defence is all about gambles and calculated risks. I am not justifying leaving vital installations unprotected. But, conceptually speaking, you can never provide the country with foolproof security.<br /><br />Thx,<br /><br />AjaiBroadswordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13076780076240598482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-63618657615159612272010-11-23T04:15:48.372-08:002010-11-23T04:15:48.372-08:00Finally We have our own systems in place , that lo...Finally We have our own systems in place , that looks more positive situation. Hope our PSU's stand upto the challenge and deliver the systems on time to plug the gaping holes in our air defence.<br /><br /> Kudos to Akash Team to develop a world class system.Had a Look at the system on it's official site www.akashsam.com .<br /><br />Ajai Sir can we know the status of other systems like Spyder, Python 5 which were supposed to be imported from Israel. I request you to post more on that front.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06765204865447860440noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-20401844545666474642010-11-23T02:51:00.617-08:002010-11-23T02:51:00.617-08:00IF we have more than 150 weak-spots in out air def...IF we have more than 150 weak-spots in out air defense, why are we ordering a paltry six systems getting delivered over a couple of years? We must make a move on and give them some big orders so that they can set up a big manufacturing supply chains and create aksah in large numbers.....shyamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16693574771785808084noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-21628026585007265242010-11-23T01:51:32.238-08:002010-11-23T01:51:32.238-08:00Ajai,there is one thing that perplexes me. Why did...Ajai,there is one thing that perplexes me. Why did DRDO choose to mount the AF version of this missile on a tractor-trailer combination. Wont this setup limit system mobility to only highways and flat hard terrain? I do not reckon seeing a system like this before.ArjunTankFannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-87656341379771259962010-11-23T01:43:30.101-08:002010-11-23T01:43:30.101-08:00Much of the information in this article is extreme...Much of the information in this article is extremely disturbing. We live in a far too complicated and elevated security environment to take such gambles. I hope that such gambles are an exception and not norm across various layers of security setup that we have in place to protect our country.Ravihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10461934576590227388noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-18831306465376135212010-11-23T00:34:57.264-08:002010-11-23T00:34:57.264-08:00What does one mean by the following: "BEL wil...What does one mean by the following: "BEL will deliver two Akash squadrons....while BDL will build six more Akash squadrons"? Who will deliver what? The guided-missiles, the launchers, the 3-D CAR, BSR and BLR? Going by how the story has been written it would appear that both BEL and BDL will 'build' identical systems, meaning that there are two operational production lines for the entire Akash SAM system. Or is the operative term meant to be 'prime contractor', with BEL being the systems integrator? <br />And what's with the facination with NATO designations of weapons of Soviet origin? Can't the SA-6 be referred to as KUB or Kvadrat? <br />The dangerous shortage of India’s air defence resources has been public knowledge since early 2002 when OP Parakram was underway. And it is not just about the Army's lack mof land-mobile area air defence systems, but also about the IAF's lack of medium-power airspace surveillance radars, the contract for which is likely to go to ThalesRaytheon.Prasun K. Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17625525921341864605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-61517813894379980272010-11-23T00:24:48.062-08:002010-11-23T00:24:48.062-08:00Excellent news...
Only if Akash missiles could be...Excellent news...<br /><br />Only if Akash missiles could be produced at the rate of rabbits.Mr. Ranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-12354395965345643332010-11-22T21:32:08.929-08:002010-11-22T21:32:08.929-08:00This is great news!
Ajai do you have any info on...This is great news! <br /><br />Ajai do you have any info on the development of Akash MKII?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8726844009873922462.post-32370281806646126682010-11-22T21:21:48.178-08:002010-11-22T21:21:48.178-08:00A bit disappointed that the tractor for the IAF ...A bit disappointed that the tractor for the IAF version is still a fragile totally unprotected civilian unit.Why could it not have been a rugged and protected one.A suitably modified BEML-TATRA 8X8,10x10 or the TATA 8X8 would have been a much more suitable vehicle for both Army and IAF.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com