Monday, 28 November 2011

T-90 tank: Technology transfer, supply of assemblies hit Russian stonewall

A decade after Russia contracted to provide technology for building 1,000 T-90S tanks in India, just 150 tanks have actually been built. Pictured here, completed T-90S tanks at Heavy Vehicle Factory (HVF), Avadi


By Ajai Shukla
Avadi, Chennai
Business Standard, 28th Nov 11

India’s purchase in 2001 of Russia’s T-90S main battle tank (MBT) was touted as a world-class upgrade of our battlefield capabilities at a rock-bottom price. For Rs 3,625 crore, India would get 310 new tanks; a full transfer of technology (ToT) from Russia; and a licence to build 1000 tanks at the Heavy Vehicle Factory (HVF) in Avadi, Chennai.

A decade later, HVF has built just 150 T-90S tanks, hamstrung by Moscow’s obstruction in transferring technology and the Russia-built assemblies needed even for the India-built tanks. With India’s production line stymied, the MoD bought 347 more ready-built T-90S tanks in 2007, handing Russia another Rs 4,900 crore. Even today, India’s T-90S fleet remains seriously constrained; with war clouds looming after the 26/11 Mumbai terror strike, the army told the government that the strike formations were critically short of equipment.

From multiple interviews with officials who handled this contract, and from a visit to HVF Avadi, Business Standard has pieced together the full saga of the T-90S. It is an account of Russian duplicity in the face of Indian submissiveness. Moscow’s readiness to disregard signed contracts was recently highlighted through its additional demands for money for the Gorshkov aircraft carrier. But the T-90S arm-twisting came before that; and constitutes a blow to the heart of Indian defence.

The Embassy of Russia in New Delhi has ignored an email asking for their comments on this issue.

Here is what happened. After the T-90S contract was signed on 15th Jan 2001, the 310 made-in-Russia tanks began to flow in quickly from Uralvagonzavod, the Russian facility that builds them. But the transfer of technology (ToT) and the supply of assemblies for building the 1000 tanks in India quickly hit a Russian stonewall.

First it took one and a half years to transfer to India the ToT documents required for building the T-90S in India. The tonnes of documents that finally arrived were found to be in Russian; translating them into English took another one and a half years.

Then HVF officials discovered that Russia had withheld key T-90S technologies without valid reason. This included technology for crucial components like the tank’s main gun and a key section of the turret armour. When New Delhi demanded those technologies, Moscow blandly responded that they were secret. To this day, Russia has not transferred full technology for building the T-90S in India.

The MoD has not responded to emailed questions about this issue. But when Business Standard asked MSN Rao, General Manager of HVF Avadi, how the T-90S was being built without these technologies, he confirmed: “We developed the tank gun indigenously in Central Ordnance Depot, Kanpur, and the turret armour component in CVRDE (Combat Vehicles R&D Establishment), Avadi. This is still a sticking point between India and Russia.”

That this remains an irritant is evident even from the careful language of MoD press releases. On 5th Oct 11, Defence Minister AK Antony met his Russian counterpart, AE Serdyukov, in the apex Indo-Russian Inter-Governmental Commission on Military-Technical Cooperation (IRIGC-MTC). The Indian press release noted, “Shri Antony drew the attention of the Russian side to the vexing issue of delayed export clearances for vital repair equipment for already contracted weapons systems. This has been affecting supplies of defence equipment and spares.”

By end-2007, Russia’s blockade of contracted T-90S technologies and components had stalled indigenous production for almost 7 years. Under pressure from the army for more tanks, the MoD capitulated to Moscow rewarding Uralvagonzavod with an order for 347 more made-in-Russia T-90S tanks. Only after this additional contract was signed did Russia begin supplying components for building the T-90S in HVF.

An Indian Army officer who voiced his frustration to his Russian counterparts recalls the taunting Russian response: “Starting T-72 production took you 10 years. How do you imagine that you will produce the T-90 in just 6-7 years?”

Meanwhile the army was struggling with a more immediate issue. In 2002, poised for war with Pakistan, the army found that the newly inducted T-90S fleet was not battle-worthy. The Thales-Optronika thermal imaging night sights supplied with the T-90S --- essential for firing tank weapons at night --- proved unable to function in the blistering desert summer. This remains a problem; in 2008 the MoD approached international vendors to air-condition the T-90S.

“If we manage to reduce the temperature by ten degrees, the performance of the electronics will be improved,” says Sudhakar K, Joint General Manager, HVF.

Veteran tank commanders ridicule the idea of air-conditioning a tank. “It would add weight, and consume more power from the tank’s limited supply. And what happens if the air-conditioning breaks down? Every tank system must function in the environment of the battlefield,” says Brigadier (Retired) Vijay Nair, a former armoured brigade commander.

During that crisis with Pakistan, the army also discovered that the T-90S sights were not calibrated to Indian tank ammunition, which was falling well short of the targets that it was fired at. A panicked MoD appealed to the DRDO and other research institutions to re-orient the T-90S’s fire control computer to Indian ammunition. Meanwhile, shiploads of tank rounds were ordered from Russia at great cost.

A simultaneous crisis developed around the T-90S’s Invar missile, earlier cited as a clinching reason for buying the tank. But the Invar missiles that came were unusable and they were quietly returned to Russia. On 2nd March 2006, Antony told Parliament, “The Invar missile on T-90 tank is not a failure. However, the completely knocked down kits received for assembly have been found to be defective.”

Russia’s status as India’s premier arms supplier is being eroded by the US, France, Israel and the UK; and by indigenous advances in areas like tank building that have long been Moscow’s stamping ground. The recent success of the indigenous Arjun tank; and any progress in developing the planned Future Main Battle Tank (FMBT), would ensure that the T-90S is the last tank that India buys from Russia.

(Tomorrow: Part II: T-90S production starts; only to quickly stall)

69 comments:

Anonymous said...

Good Article. Hopefully, our babus in Army & Aiforce might learn the lesson from this and start working with organizations like DRDO & private vendors and develop indigineous technologies.


This way we not only have our own technologies but also can employ millions of indians and uplift from poverty.

Wisc.

Anonymous said...

Col.Shukla having commanded an armoured regiment, what in your opinion goes against more orders for the Arjun given the fact that the T-90 program is floundering and we have clearly been taken on a ride by the russians

Anonymous said...

I will save this article for posterity. Thanks for sharing this in black and white something that was all along suspected. We might as well indigenise the whole tank and start production and stop paying royalty to the Russians and say we are recovering our costs with that.

Anonymous said...

If this is how they behave ' a trusted supplier' as its put in many press releases then we should start to look elsewhere. But as long as we come across as weak negotiators this will continue. (

Anonymous said...

What does India expect? Do our defense scientists really think that any foreign country will part its hard-to-obtain technology for a price? I can't comprehend what types of buffoons the Indian defense research establishment has fostered? Just the previous day another Indian blog site "Livefist" was crying hoarse about copyright infringement of its photos and articles for some magazine. If that guy feels offended for lifting his defense articles, then just imagine why would Russia or any other nation part with defense technology. I am repeating, Indian ministries are lying to Indians while filling their own pockets. No surprise, our state of affairs is in shambles. Just imagine what games Russia must have conjured for the PAK-FA??? Good luck to HAL, DRDO etc...getting that thing to work in the next "whatever" years. What India needs is TATA, L&T and other private sector MNCs a free run for defense production. Only the private sector has the capabilities to assimilate critical defense technologies and perform research for profits. HAL, DRDO, ISRO should be privatized to the highest bidder, only then our scientist start performing.

Jey said...

Good reason to place more orders for Arjun? I believe in every bad thing happens there will be some opportunity for future success...

Anonymous said...

I shed tears of blood reading ur report...

Sameer said...

This attitude neither new nor restricted to India. Consider the case of Chengdu J-7, the Chinese replica of Mig-21 built after Transfer of Technology. The wiki article on J-7 reads..
----
Chinese were not optimistic about gaining the technology and thus were prepared for reverse engineering. Five months after the deal was signed, Soviets delivered the kits, parts and documents to Shenyang Aircraft Factory. Just as the Chinese had expected, it was discovered that the technical documents provided by the Soviets were incomplete and some of the parts could not be used. China set about to reverse engineer the aircraft for local production, and in doing so, succeeded in solving 249 major problems and came up with eight major technical documents that were not delivered.
----
Ultimately, the Chinese went on to manufacture 2400 such aircraft including those which were sold to 16 other countries.

The bottom line - Stop living in the oblivion of so called strategic/political alliance (with ANYONE). Maintaining good diplomatic relations is another thing but when it comes to defending our borders and interests, we don't have a choice but to stand up on our own feet.

Anonymous said...

All fine and dandy. But if only the Army brass had bought into this need of having home made weapons systems for bread and butter systems like tanks and artillery, things would have been in far far better shape.

Needless to say, their attitudes sucked and sucked big time. If the DGMF and other brass had spent their energy in working with the DRDO and ironing out the teething troubles during development, rather than try sabotaging it, the Arjun could have been fielded some close to a decade ago and some 2 more versions could have come out by now.

DHRUV said...

Sir, if these are really true why our army is reluctant to order more arjuns?
''reading your reports I am sure arjun can beat t90s any day''.
A 60 tonn tank will surely have more protection for it crews, n every where i have read on net it too has a superior gun.
But a question haunts me ''why an army llike ours will risk life of its men by opting for t90 which is inferior to arjun?''
Hope sir this time i will get my answers:)

saran said...

Dear Sir
It is good to know that even we struggling to get the TOT FROM RUSSIA

Apart from subject matter it's build not built i am learning eng, sorry

Gourish said...

This is awesome..you really come out with all guns blazing when it comes to arjun vs T-90..excellent report..hope someone in the decision making circles of mod and the army share your point of view after getting their fingers burned for so many years..thanks a lot for making my day..was worth the wait..thanks..

Anonymous said...

India does not have semiconductor wafer manufacturing technology for even the simplest of microprocessors. Nor does India have a road-map for such critical areas. How then does our political administration think of developing sophisticated electronics systems? From imported semiconductors? What India needs is politicians from Engineering and Science backgrounds with MBA under their belt, all others should be debarred from running for any government position and office. From abroad, all I see is a bunch of hypocrites, performing the worst kind of foolishness of self aggrandizement. Indians are living in fools paradise. While villagers in Jabalpur make meals using firewood, Indian defense scientists complain Russia doesn't provide necessary ToT. All such people who give silly excuses should be immediately thrown out from office. There is an ancient Indian saying, "Jaisa Raja, waisi Praja". What can then, the "praja" do?

Philip said...

Saw your article in today's BS. I am glad you minced no words while calling Ruskie duplicity as duplicity.
Ruskie high handedness is outrageous and conduct unbecoming of a supposed ally. They are wringing us dry in every transaction- land,naval and aerial.
There is an urgent need focus more attention and energy towards Arjun and it is high time we Indians get used to the fact that Russia is not Soviet.
It is heartening to see Antony, who has failed his State as a Member of Parliament showing some fortitude as the Defence Minister of the Union.

Nikhil said...

Excellent article throwing much needed light to the farce that is the T-90. There are some questions the army must answer:
1. How is it that these functional defects were detected only in the crises ?
2. How is it that the QA/Testing procedures were absolutely a sham that Invars didn't function, the electronics gave up in the desert, the engines broke down repeatedly, the ammunition did not fire correctly and the tank gun was not passed on? I mean could there BE ANYTHING MORE WRONG WITH A "TANK"??
3. Why the hell is the Army/MoD giving them repeated orders for more off-the-shelf tanks, more tank ammo ?

Thanks again for the wonderful article.

Anonymous said...

Seems like the U.S. CIA is paying you well Col Shukla ji

But the fact is, Russia is far more reliable and trustworthy when it comes to helping India. Who would've sold us ma great platform like su-30mki to a foreign country even by not equipping it's air-force.

The saga of INS Vikramaditya is infact a sad story. The people at those ntimes have miscalculated the costs required to upgrade it. Mistakes do happen sir.

Many of the Army commanders have acknowledged that T-90 is one of the best tank being operated in the world. Just wait with proper upgrades and after resolving all the issues related to ToT, it will definitely turn out to be a beast like Su-30.

Ultimately, it's the people in battlefield decide which machines best suites them, not someone who is in HVF. They've alredy created a big mess in the name of Arjuna

Broadsword said...

@ DESHDAAZ

Your comment blocked. I am gratified that you want Broadsword to be compulsory reading for all MPs in parliament... but your description of those MPs is definitely profane!

Anonymous said...

There is only us to blame, not the Russians. To think that you can throw money to buy crown jewels is fallacy. The MOD did the same thing with Groshkov. The obsession with cost has done us in. With MMRCA it has swung to the other spectrum. Buying fighters twice the cost of the most battle tested fighter. Also to think that the Europeans will tranfers technology, is fallacy again.

Woe betide MOD and the defence bureaurcacy

vivek said...

the only reason why we are still buying stuff from russia is because they are the only ones who are willing to transfer technology to us (unlike west), even u have acknowledged this in one of your earlier articles, why all these problems with T90 then? why has this been so different ?

Anonymous said...

I will not be surprised if sum Anonymous say that you are payed by DRDO to write this article....But anyways good article as usual...I think the Russie Govt may not be involved in this but the russie industries which produces T-90...Bcoz we are not facing any problems with Su-30mki and we are churning out them like cakes....May be russian factories producing weapons for army and navy are in profits so they have the attitude to keep there customer beging around them....

If the case with $900 million tank is of this kind i fear to even imagine about $30 Billion FGFA...!!!

raghunath said...

Does anyone of our politician has the guts to make this election issue. equally do we possess to digest the contents to make an informed Voting? all this stupidity on Gov is only due to Non Accountability of Babus & moreover Ministers, that is costing us dearly. somwhere we are mimicking the irrrational behaviour of americans, which landed their economy in deep shit.

Anonymous said...

Col. Shukla, I am just repeating the question here which others have raised.

Why not the Arjun, if the T-90s are terrible..

Having commanded a tank regiment yourself, you can give us a ring side view of things.

Anonymous said...

I still do not get it why we cannot involve a TATA or an L&T into the manufacturing of heavy weapons.WE do not even encourage other PSUs like BHEL who wanted the Arjun line.

Why do we continue to protect OFB which only throttles innovation and competition.Even,when the OFBs want to modernize,the ministry delays the process in endless files.

Rahul said...

“We developed the tank gun indigenously in Central Ordnance Depot, Kanpur,"

Does it means, we now have indigenous main gun on made-in-India T-90S? If answer is 'YES' then Kudos to our scientists for developing smoothbore 125 mm gun, doesn't matter if it just reverse engineering.

PrabhuG said...

anonymous at 10.32 Have u heard about this
http://www.scl.gov.in/

This would be enough for our defense

saran said...

in near future congress government will say that procuring weapons from foreign country is so costly that's why we have new plan we will give glopal tender to foreign military and navy and air-force to guard India,??????

may be it will happen??? if some one offers a good deal to Indian politicians, they are not thinking this as a country and humans are living here, but we are like a ATM machines, and their one and only aim is through us earning money that's why they are still here otherwise they will be in some other country's.,we (I)as a common man only thinking somehow other some one will save us, hope hope still hoping ????? like Arjun tank, LCA Tejas,now at least Shuklaji is giving some hope atleast

Anonymous said...

Thanx again for Insights..

Arjun is better in performance than T-90S, But As again and Again i have said the issues with Arjun deign remain expose till today, Even the Arjun MK2 does not completely hide the problems..

Arjun share a major flaw with LEO A4 turret deign, I dont know how DRDO didn't look at it, Where as Europeans corrected it long back and newer LEO2A5/6/7 are in corrected form..

Kunal..

Santosh said...

Russia of today is not the Soviet Union of the yesteryears. Today's Russia is a kleptocracy run by the Russian mafias.

It is time that India ended its partnership with Moscow and invested the vast sums in developing our own industry. I sincerely hope we don't waste billions on the PAK-FA fighter and invest spend that money on developing our own fighters and if need be, supplement with a few F-35s.

Tank technology is not that hard to master. The hardest element is the armor. For the rest, India already has sufficient engineering prowess.

Russia is a bygone power, that Putin and co will drive into the dustbin of history. In a few decades, China will be threatening to occupy Siberia and Russia will be left impotent to respond. If we have a half-competent government, then when the day comes, Russia has to turn to India for weapons systems.

B M said...

Ajaiji,

Finally someone dared to call a spade a spade. How does burecrats with not technical or legal acumen lead teams that negotiate such contracts. Atleast we should get these contracts vetted by experts before the khadhi clad ***** sign on the dotted lines. See how we handled the bofors gun TOT. All along we were having the docs, just that no one bothered to check if they are complete in every sense before paying up. Then no one is accountable in this country. Give a commission and anything can be managed.

Anonymous said...

What a bl00dy disgrace.

And the entire disgrace lies squarely with the MOD and the cajunaless idiots who negotiated the contracts and let the Ruskies get away with it.

Col. in your professional opinion is this tank worth getting into or is it entirely a tin can?

Great piece again.

PHL

Hari said...

Very nice article as usual sir. I have one question though, What according to you makes the army still keep wanting these T 90 tanks even after so much trouble. I have seen an interview from Lt Gen Bhardwaj who still was trying to upgrade the existing T 72's instead of going for Arjun tanks. Would be great if you can provide us some insight on this. Thanks

Anonymous said...

Like us you probably have been seething with rage for some time learning of how we are being duped by our 'old friends'. But do you think our 'new friends' with their 'F cough 35 cough' would be any less duplicitous.

Is not the issue here of two things?, negotiation[at the time of contract] and using leverage[to enforce compliance when things do not work out as expected]. We seem to be deficient in either.

I also feel our lack of homegrown development has two reasons, lack of vision by the army and defensive attitude by our research organisations. However both could be due to uncertainty and dithering at the government level. It needs to be headed by a strong decisive personality, something that is neccessary initially- especially when they are talking about a MI Complex.

There is too much to write and rant but some of the posters above have brought out some points very well.

Anyway... Your arjun stories rock.

Manne said...

The risk is IA's to convert into an opportunity. Gandeev ki tanatkaar kab sunai degi?

- Manne

Anonymous said...

Col,
Your comment about T-90's gun barrel is interesting. Do you mean we have two versions of barrel on the T-90s? Indian made on local T-90 and Russian on imported T-90?

If the barrel is Indian made, then we developed a smoothbore our self.

Very interesting. Is the barrel produced in HVF? What about the auto-loader integration with the Indian barrel?
Do we plan to import the barrel from Russia for the remaining production of T-90.

Indian smoothbore should let us heavily use Indian and Israeli 125mm rounds.

Good stuff.

Anonymous said...

was the thermal imagers' issues a problem with all tanks or the indian built ones ..did they sell us 300 good ones then start dumping on us
assuming its with all tanks....did they trick us in the trials...if we got 300 tanks..how come the issue didnt get noticed before...is there a lapse in acceptance procdures

sorry but " A panicked MoD appealed to the DRDO and other research in.." made me laugh!!

Anonymous said...

Russian won't do it... to the dragon... why... Ps and Ms balls are... in the hands of the... dragon... if they even dream anything remotely... the dragon will goug-out every R ball... so they can show off to a... friend only that... they have balls... even if they don't... since a friend will always... mind the well being of its... friends...

Mr. Ra said...

India would have been in NATO etc, if we did not have neighbors like China and Pak and also India would have no chances of purchasing a developing Tank like T-90.

It needs to be checked whether timely enquiries were made or not for other available options like Abram, Leopard, Challenger and LeClerk etc. If only medium MBT were required, then what were the options except perhaps for the Al-Khalid.

Since Tejas and Arjun both were not emerging up timely on the scene, so it must have prompted India to pay for the development of Su-30 and T-90. Now this insight has been thoroughly vindicated in the case of Su-30 MkI and may hopefully also for T-90 with the development and up-gradation to T-90AM with proper ToT and financial handling at least by now.

Actually to alleviate any of the problems on the MBT front as on today, at least 600 Nos of Arjun-Mk1A should be ordered immediately.

Anonymous said...

Good article but a few critisisms: its unfortunate you did not comment on the point of India broadening its dependencies in response to recent concerns surrounding Russian arms purchases rather than taking what must obviously be the take home message of this article; India needs greater independence.

Additionally with regard to technology transfer, without seeing the actual legal documents its insuffcient to just say 'full technology transfer' when complaining. Modern machines are systems of systems, for example if I purchased ToT for a Bruker mass spectrometer I would not expect to get complete information about the Varien turbomolecular pumps used in the design as they are a seperate entity.

Comment on Russian documentation is also a little unfair (unless stipulated in the contracts), I imagine a lot of information in Western purchases is avaliable only in English.

I have to agree with an above commentator though, in many ways Russia seems a scapegoat for Indian incompetance.

Rajeev said...

Ajai, is there no recourse for India? Can any Russian company disregard the documents signed by them? Can India not file the case against Rosoboronexport in Russian courts, however twisted Russia may try to pull the wool, can any country claim to say they could withdraw from signed contract?

Anonymous said...

I think there is some mis-guided heat for Russia here - We need to remember that the Russians were (back in 2001) and still are learning a whole new way of doing business that's quite different from the ways of the USSR.
They haven't quite yet learned how to value contracts, especially ones that cover ToT. Also, in Russia, penalties for non fulfillment of a contract is very hard to enforce.

No other country in this world will offer to sell India nuclear subs, or offer ToT on their front line tanks.

Its the Indian negotiators who need to smarten up. I do hope the T-90S is the last imported MBT in India.

Cujo

Anonymous said...

Anonymous... @17:49... do you know why... coffin gate happened... its no laughing matter... panic... when u intend to give... the utmost in respect... doing things... for the personnel & country... before and after... hands... legs tied... GOI/MOD... in a given situation... things like panic... happens... and there are people... inside and outside... waiting like vultures... to take udvantage of... our pathetic situation... its no laughing matter...

Anonymous said...

@ anonymous at 10:43
Time to call a spade a spade
I know of a friend who has worked with these tanks (as in use them as a user in field firing) and he confirms that the Indian ammo is not calibrated (or the sights aren't zeroed with the wrong algorithms fed in the fire control/ballistic computers)in the T-90s). Missiles misfire/missing the target rate is worryingly high (& it's the same gunners who were dead accurate with the 105mm gun of the (up-gunned) T-55 - so it's not attributable to human error either) . Engine life is appallingly low and yes , the optronics malfunction - but then the heat & the wide temperature difference is to blame. (However the thermal imaging sights provided by the Israelis work admirably well in the heat). Time for "Mr Clean" AK Anthony to take a stand and get some spine. Arjun may not be there -yet. But it's still a force (or tank) to reckon with, in its own right. And what about the rumours of the kickbacks in getting the T-90 deal through- from honeypots to premium apartments in swanky locales? Did anyone think about it. 400 crores for Scorpene deal - & nothing for the T-90s? Hard to believe , eh?

Manish said...

Hey people, sorry for being a noob here. I was googling about this smooth/rifled bore thing. I learned about pros and cons of both. Apart from our Arjun and brit Challenger 2, all modern tanks are smooth bored and after challenger's CLIP upgrade, we're gonna be the sole users of rifled bore.
I thought DRDO would have gone for the rifled bore by choice but seeing the oh-did-we-do-it-ourselves reaction from some users above makes me think otherwise. I fail to understand what could be so difficult about a smooth bore, especially when we have already put together a system with rifled bore.

Can some one shed light on this?
TIA

Anonymous said...

why is still india depend on Russia??? India know after spending Billions it gets notthing still it says Russia as it Best Partners... Russia has always used indian money in their research. Still not giving any access to India and india is still relying on Russia Why????

Why Is india so keen on buying technology from russia only???

Why is India not spending wisely with other country??

Anonymous said...

Buying a downgraded foreign tank over superior Indian one is a great mistake or scandal. It should be proven by CBI or judiciary.

Aditya said...

As much as I came down heavily on you for the F-35/MMRCA post, I appreciate your incredible reporting on the tank issue over the years, Ajai. Thanks.

Anonymous said...

The irony is that MOD never learns from their mistakes. And now we are investing in the 5th gen aircraft with Moscow. I foresee that India will face the same problems regarding TOT, just like the T-90 tanks and would end up spending another couple of billion dollars.

Anonymous said...

PrabhuG, what you have is a "Laboratory" that too managed by "Dept of Space". What I am talking about is, microprocessors with GHz speeds and not EEPROM and CCD imagers. Making state-of-art sensors, and processors capable of running complex algorithms such as image & video processing, digital communications, networking hardware, ASICs, needs an industrial manufacturing base not a laboratory. No wonder our cryogenic rocket engines don't yet fly successfully. Have you ever worked in a public sector company? You will understand what I am saying. When Indian soldiers risk their lives for the nation, all that our ministers, bureaucrats, and research scientist do is make their seats warm and hatch plans to stretch their terms in office, without even being aware that, their tardiness is costing someones life on the border. For every soldier's life lost on the border, a related research dept scientist should face the firing squad. Only then they will realize how much precious time and resources they are wasting. If they don't have what it takes to deliver, they should vacate their office and look for opportunities elsewhere. There is no shame is admitting failure.

Anonymous said...

Yeh dil maange (1000 pieces of this garbage tin can) more !!!

Anonymous said...

Moral of the story..."Nothing comes on the platter"...Just because you bought it, doesn't mean you will get all the manufacturing technologies, equations / algorithms, programs running behind the scenes etc etc..

Nobody on this earth would be willing to give anything like this, including russians.

If anyone is thinking Israelis or americans would be giving, he/she is living in a fools paradise.

And if we have some self respect, we wont ask also. We would do on our own, be it DRDO or from any private indian company!..I would only laugh if some one comes forward and says they would give Jet Engine Technology!!!

-Sudheendra S

Anonymous said...

ajaj ji you are grate.....keep it up

Rahul said...

http://indrus.in/articles/2011/11/29/russia_sticks_to_all_the_agreements_with_india_on_the_t-90_tanks_13315.html



Russian response

Bulusu said...

Russia responded to your report !!

http://en.rian.ru/world/20111130/169159735.html

Sidirenko said...

claims that Russia has betrayed India or has refused to transfer the T-90S-related manufacturing technologies that it had earlier promised to are equally false and downrught mischievous. These claims can only be made by folks who haven;t read the contractual documents. The fact remains that right from the start Russia NEVER agreed to share the production technologies of its K-5 ERA tiles & the 2A46M-2 cannon with India. ToT regarding these two items was NEVER put on the table by Russia, for starters. So how can Russia be blamed for something it did never committed to in the first place? The Russians have learnt a bitter lesson from the former eastern Bloc countries like Poland, Slovakia, Czech republic & Croatia (part of erstwhile Yugoslavia) that have blatantly sold T-72 clones post-1991 and therefore Moscow has been determined never to let history repeat itself. That's why it even refused to supply the 2A46M cannons for the Malaysian PT-91Ms of Polish origin, and the cannons were ultimately supplied by Kerametal of Slovakia. And Russia isn't the sole exception when it comes to practising such policies. For instance, how many countries using the Rheinmetal-developed 120mm smoothbore cannon have actually produced it under licence? Not the Japanese, not the South Koreans, not the Swedes, Singaporeans or Poles, not Israel, and not Turkey. So why should anyone expect Russia to make the exception for India? And what exactly is to be gained by making such cannons in-country? How does it translate into any operational advantage over one's enemies? And especially in India's case it is far more cost-effective to import the 2A46M-2 directly from Russia and use the money saved to further improve and enhance the performance of the Arjun MBT's indigenous 120mm rifled-bore cannon.

Anonymous said...

Colonel,

I hope you publish the Russian rebuttal to your allegations, as appeared in the Indian press.

Earthlingam said...

You are clearly being paid off by Martians to weaken Earth defences as a prelude to full-scale invasion.

The Martians I have long suspected own Lockheed Martin, Boeing, DRDO and of course Anna Hazare (anyone see the resemblance?).

Anonymous said...

Waiting for Part II

Pandu said...

India is like a nouveau riche widow whom every Tom, Dick and Harry wants to fornicate and take money from. Rifles, Arty, Tanks, Ships, Trucks you name it we have it imported. I suggest we import the underwear from France so that our soldiers can sleep in soft comfort of the real Frenchies.

Anonymous said...

what happened to the second part of the article? did russians make u stop?

Anonymous said...

FYI - maybe you should respond

http://www.asian-defence.net/2011/11/russia-denies-indian-media-allegations.html#more

I still cant get it - why is it so diffcult to put together a good indian tank... If bosch supplys some tank components they do so by getting a chunk of it developed/ tested or manufactured in bangalore !!

Unknown said...

Its time we discarded the russians whose armament industry we bankrolled during soviet disintegration and looked ahead.The russian arms industry in simple words has lost the professinalism of the soviet era.Now all we get is delayed delivery schedules,spare shortages,substandard equipment.We should mass produce arjun tank and replace T-72'.

Anonymous said...

part II..... ?????????

Anonymous said...

part II..... ?????????

Anonymous said...

Shuklaji, I am sure you are now pressured by the Russian lobby not to publish anything that paints a poor picture of russia

Anonymous said...

sukla ji part 2 please......

Broadsword said...

I am, in fact, being pressured by the Russians --- and directly, not through lobbies!

But just as this blog carries its own views on the F-35, it will carry its own views on the T-90S.

Next article posted.

Max said...

Typical poorly researched article that tries to land the blame on Russia for the incapability of Indian production partners to master the production to a required standard.

India blamed Russia for badly wearing barrels. Russia proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that its the India-made rounds to blame as they weren't even straight. India bought a massive batch of Russian-made rounds and problems with barrels stopped. Hmm wonder why...

India blamed Russia for systems failing in the Indian desert heat. Russians shown the documents where it was clear that India itself rejected the air conditioner for T-90 to cut costs. After that Air Conditioner was sourced and installed on T-90. Problems almost completely disappeared down to levels where they are no bigger or smaller then average.

The way India looks after the tech and stores it is also stuff of legends with expensive missiles and rounds left virtually out in elements. That includes precision guided artillery rounds that were withstanding the carelessness and elements in India much better then designers thought. Thats considering that India rejected the tropical version. After that India bought a large batch of tropical version of those rounds.

Russians briefed India on all the care that MUST be taken with T-90 and its systems. Wouldn't surprise me that Indian military doesn't really take all the due care that it should. And Russians are to blame heh?

To those stating that India should toss Russia away as a partner. Who is India going to be left with? The USA? The democracy spreaders? Beware what you wish for.

Anonymous said...

As an Indian, I am very grateful to Russia, for providing us the means to defend our country in times of crisis.
All my earlier comments 9:29, 10:32, 4:43 are squarely putting blame on Indian incompetence, be it military, bureaucracy, scientists and ministers. Having worked in public sector as an Engineer before and now working abroad, I feel the older generation is stifling growth. Another worrying trend, I am reading is news, is the prospects of reservation quota for the minorities by the politicians. Such senseless meddling in strategic areas, where merit deserves the rank, our older generation of so-called babus, netas and ministers are sowing the seeds of destabilization of the nation. For this, how can we ever blame any foreign nation. It is within that we have to do soul searching. To fellow Indians, be careful who you point fingers at. Especially to the Top rung leaders in Public offices, be careful who you promote, if you prefer nepotism, you are condemning Indians to slavery, and repeat of history. Democracy is for people who are self-confident, self-aware, self-independent, self-conscious, religiously plural in their beliefs and above all literate to a certain standard. If even one of these qualities is missing, we would end up is a fake democracy as that is being practiced today in India. A hereditary mindset, amalgam democracy.

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